Hand, HYDRA, what?

[eliyes]

I've been trying to figure out who killed Northstar.

Okay, no; obviously Wolverine killed Northstar, but I've been trying to work out who exactly was controlling Wolverine, and who subsequently brought Northstar back and sent him on a killing spree, whereupon he was apaprently "killed" by Wolverine again, while actually being taken by S.H.I.E.L.D. to be deprogrammed (which didn't work, and he was then stolen and brainwashed by Serafina and her bunch).

I've seen it said that it was the Hand. I've seen it said that it was HYDRA. I've seen the phrase "Dawn of the White Light" thrown around.

I'm very confused, so of course I turned to Google.

So, according to Wikipedia, "The Hand is a cult of evil mystical ninjas who are heavily involved in organized crime and mercenary activities such as assassination plots. The Hand covets power above all other objectives. They are primarily based in Japan, but operate internationally."¹. (More pages from various sources here and here.) Apparently part of their dealing is killing people and bringing them abck as servants of the Hand.

Which would work pretty well in the case of Northstar, maybe?

So the Hand are mystic ninjas, whereas HYDRA are sort of Nazi international terrorists formed in Japan and Germany during the second World War ^{2 3 4 5} HYDRA has it's fingers in all sorts of pies. They recently kidnapped and brainwashed Jamie Madrox, and one of the various branches that split off and became independant are the sods that captured and tormented Kyle Gibny when he was a young teen (and he always did have that fixation on Northstar).

Still confused.

Marvel.com, a summary of "Enemy of the State", the story in which the event in question took place, it says: "Hydra, The Hand and a mutant group known as the Dawn of the White Light formed an alliance in order to execute their plan. The plan was to kill and resurrect super heroes under their control."

But - why were they working together? I mean, wouldn't it have been obvious how they were going to inevitably turn on each other? Were they planning to merge? Technically, who was controlling Northstar when he came back, the Hand or HYDRA?

Comments

[croaky.livejournal.com]

God and SuperHeroComicsPlots WORKS IN MYSTERIOUS WAYS.

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

It's true!

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

I mean, wouldn't it have been obvious how they were going to inevitably turn on each other?

You know, you would think so. But villainous megolomaniac types never do seem to have the common sense that the readers all have.

In any case, it was a horrendous crime that never should have been committed. A lot like turning Jono into Apocalypse Jr.

And this is where fic comes in, to ignore all the trash that Marvel does and have it OUR way!

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

And this is where fic comes in, to ignore all the trash that Marvel does and have it OUR way!

Yay! And sometimes we can appropriate the decent ideas for our own uses, too. :3

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

And that is when the magic happens.

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

God, I hope so.

The reason why I'm staring particularly hard at the involvement of the Hand in all this is a) Psylocke, and b) Bobby.

Or more accurately, Opal.

Didn't it turn out her family were Hand ninjas? She agreed to stop seeing Bobby in exchange for her family leaving him alone?

I know in the Iceman mini-series, which is right before or shortly after Northstar joins the team, I think, Opal summons Bobby to Hong Kong to save her son. Thus breaking the deal.

I can't help but wonder if this was an elaborate revenge. Because if the Hand brought JP back, technically it was a Hand agent who killed him - he just got better.

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

I... do not remember anything about Opal. ^^ But you know what? That would work really well in a fanfic!

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

I'm trying to conffirm that it was the Hand; I know it was cyber-ninjas. *nods*

She was a spunky gal, I really liked her, but she wanted to be normal and as much as Bobby sometiems also wants to be normal, this was during a period where the X-Men wouldn't let him. Warren aprticularly rides him, in fact it really seems like he's cockblocking. B| Everytime Bobby's getting snuggly with his girlfriend, Warren calls him away!

Bobby also gets relationship dvice from Colossus during this period, which is hysterical, but I have to wodner who the hell dressed him. Baggy jeans and a wallet chain + checkered brown button up shirt. OI.

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

I will always hold to it that Warren is at the very least, bi.

You know, I have to wonder sometimes what comic writers do, sitting around their little table, when they come up with things like "her family is made up of cyber ninjas."

Who's dressing Colossus now? Have you seen his uniform? Half of it appears to have gone missing.

..Not that I'm complaining, mind.

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

I will always hold to it that Warren is at the very least, bi.

Why's that? :D

You know, I have to wonder sometimes what comic writers do, sitting around their little table, when they come up with things like "her family is made up of cyber ninjas."

I think in this case it was a
"Quick! How can we get rid of her?"
"Well, since she keeps saying she just wants to be normal -- obviously she must have something truly bizarre in her background!"
"Cyber ninjas!"
"Brilliant!"

It was a really obvious getting-rid-of-girlfriend ploy, though, particularly since there was that corollary of never seeing her again on pain of death.

Who's dressing Colossus now? Have you seen his uniform? Half of it appears to have gone missing.

Kitty, I would guess.

...I did actually mean that it was Bobby in the skater jeans. That wasn't very clear, sorry.

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

1. Because he's pretty, and I want him to be bi. I need no supporting evidence for my claim! lol

2. It seems to me like comic book writers do a lot of really obvious things like that. It bugs me. I wonder where the subtle genius is?

3. Ohhh! My bad. But you know, a lot of artists draw Bobby with really poor fashion taste. (Um, leather pants and Hawaiian shirts anyone?) so it doesn't really strike me as odd. ^^;;

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

See, okay, I have a theory about the Hawai'ian shirts and the purple leather. First of all, Bobby has never worn anything remotely like that before, as a costume. I think they stuck him in the leather in their effort to make everyone look more "street" and he threw in the ugly not-quite-Hawai'ian shirt to rebel. (Because it's Hank who rhapsodises over Hawai'ian shirts, not Bobby.) And honestly, by the hell does Bobby need a coat? Talk about getting in the way! I think Scott pulled him aside and was all "look, you can't keep running around looking nude or like you're only in briefs. We have kids here now. We'll get sued."

His costume has changed like 4 times since Emma joined. X| So I want to blame her.

[naiveprophet.livejournal.com]

*giggle* running around in the nude/itty bitty briefs. GOD. What were the comic writers trying to say, I wonder?

I love that they brought Northstar back in his old costume. It was SUCH a cool costume!

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

Even when he was wearing a catsuit and gloves and boots, when he iced up it looked like ice and briefs. Considering his first costume was snow and boots...

Then again, Cloud went into battle nude. So. Whatever, I guess.

(It's not like Bobby's going to get cold.)

Northstar's original costume has a great design. I'm glad he keeps going back to it, and even the thing he's wearing in my icon does have it as the inspiration, with the star on the side and all.

*shakes head* Oh, Kiya Asamiya. I like Silent Moebius, but you never should have been let at the X-Men...